Sales Maven founder Nikki Rausch (20+ years training sales teams) reveals the flexible conversation framework that converts prospects while competitors follow rigid scripts that cost them clients.

The sad truth is that far too many interior designers watch less talented competitors win projects they “deserved”. They create stunning spaces and deliver exceptional service, yet prospects choose designers with inferior portfolios and, even worse, higher prices.

In today’s episode of the Interior DesignHer podcast, we speak with Nikki Rausch, founder of Sales Maven, about how she trains interior designers to conduct sales conversations that convert prospects into paying clients….without feeling like an icky door to door salesman.

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CHAPTERS:

01:22 - Origin Story

03:20 - NLP

06:24 - Natural Talent for Sales?

08:00 - Truth Hurts

10:45 - Sales Structure

13:19 - Nikki's Process

19:19 - Commonalities

21:10 - Interior Design is Different

25:23 - The Questions You Ask

31:19 - Sales in a Vibe-Cession

39:31 - Sales Techniques for Nervous "Clients"

48:29 - Buying Signals

57:30 - Reassurance

1:01:29 - A Different Kind of Coach

1:09:02 - Follow-Up

1:11:55 - Multiple Decision Makers

1:16:49 - Referrals

1:21:13 - Consultations

1:28:49 - How to Judge Clients

1:32:15 - Instagram and Sales

1:33:31 - How to Work with Nikki

1:35:05 - What to Expect - $$$

1:36:56 - Be Brave

1:40:01 - Outro

1:40:31 - Free Gift from Nikki

Most interior designers lose qualified prospects not because they lack design talent, but because their sales conversations have either zero structure, or a super-rigid structure that repels potential clients

Consider this scenario: You present a stunning portfolio to a prospect who seems engaged and interested. You follow conventional sales advice, emphasize your worth, and present your full-service package.

The prospect says they'll think about it, then hires a competitor with inferior work and higher prices.

This frustrating pattern repeats because far too many interior designers fly by the seat of their pants OR rely on scripted sales approaches that ignore individual prospect needs and communication styles.

Nikki Rausch, founder of Sales Maven, spent 20+ years training sales teams and discovered that successful interior design sales require flexibility, not rigid formulas. Her neurolinguistic programming background revealed how small conversation adjustments dramatically impact prospect decisions.

During our interview, Nikki explained how her 5-step Selling Staircase framework helps designers convert prospects through natural conversations rather than pushy sales presentations.

She challenges the conventional "know your worth" advice, showing how this approach often costs designers more clients than it wins.

Whether you're currently struggling with prospect conversion or want to improve your closing rate, you’re going to love my convo with Nikki Rausch.

Key Takeaways:

Sales conversations require flexibility over rigid scripts - Successful interior designers adapt their communication style to match individual prospect preferences rather than following one-size-fits-all approaches
The "know your worth" advice often backfires with qualified prospects - Leading with value and pricing creates resistance; asking questions and building rapport creates connection and trust
Questions are more powerful than presentations in sales situations - Prospects reveal exactly how to earn their business when designers ask thoughtful questions about their needs, timeline, and decision-making process
Building rapport creates the foundation for successful sales - Interior designers who make prospects comfortable in conversation stay engaged longer and receive more revealing information about earning their business
Long-term client relationships start with thoughtful sales conversations - Designers who focus on understanding prospects rather than convincing them create stronger foundations for ongoing client partnerships
Introverted designers can excel at sales through conversation-based approaches - The Selling Staircase framework works especially well for designers who prefer building relationships over traditional sales presentations

Read the Transcript:

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: No, for sure. Kind of tying back into, our. Our concerns right now with the economy. I'm assuming a lot of the pushback, is going to be on price. I mean, it's always going to be on price, but it's definitely going to be on price right now.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And, you know, talking about the story you told, where if people, you know, the potential client is saying, the designer, you know, you know, my friend had this really bad experience, they wouldn't be having the meeting with your designer client in the first place if they weren't interested at some level. Right. So you nailed it. They've. They've expressed an interest in doing now, whether it works with you or with someone else, but they're express. They're. They're expressing their fear, their concern. Right. So how do you handle that? Do you try to make them feel like they're in a safe space or, or whatever? Or do you tell them, you know, that's ridiculous, or, oh, that must have been a horrible design. Right. I mean, it requires a certain amount of bravery on their part to say that to you, that, you know, this. This bad experience. And they're implicitly saying, we don't want this to happen to us.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. So what they're essentially looking for is some kind of reassurance from you about how working with you will be different, and your job is to offer that up to them. I'm so sorry you had that experience. Here's what you can expect when we work together. Is that something you're. That. Is that something that's in alignment for you? Is that something that would fit for you? Like, all you're doing is offering information, and they can, you know, take it or not take it. But chances are, if you're willing to, like, I'm sorry, that was your experience, or, gosh, that. That does sound like a terrible experience. Here's what you can expect when we work together, and just making it in the, like, present terms of what, what's going to happen and what the process is, how you're going to reassure, or, or make sure that whatever their fear is is not going to come to fruition. Now you have to understand what the fear is. Hopefully they'll, you know, through your questions you've, you've determined like, what's that thing that they're hesitant about? What's the thing that's holding them back? And then there is this idea of, you know, we talk about objections in sales, right? Like people have objections. And your job when somebody voices an objection is to check to see can you overcome it. And the way you do that is through what's known as a conditional close question. So, the structure of a conditional close question is if I were able to solve this, overcome this, would you then be willing to X, Y and Z, move forward, hire me, do whatever? Now you're gonna change your conditional close question based on the context. But if somebody's pushing back around, like, you know, I have some real fear about working with a designer because my friend had this really bad experience and they got, you know, four months and, or four, weeks into the process and the designer like completely dropped the ball and just disappeared. Then you can say, I'm really sorry that happened to you. One of the things that, that you can expect when you work with me is we have this process that involves follow ups. If for any reason that process fell by the wayside, if I put into your contract that you would have an out, would that make you feel more comfortable about working, working together? Right. Like, I'm just checking to see if I can overcome the objection. And if she's like, there's really nothing you could say because I just don't trust you, well, that's not your client, so bless and release, that's okay. But we've got to check. We have to be willing to extend ourselves in some way. And you had mentioned earlier a lot of the, you know, a lot of designers out there are solopreneurs or they have a small team. One of the benefits of having a small team or being a solopreneur is you're nimble and you can make adjustments to your contract. You can, you can offer something that is going to solve or potentially overcome that objection for somebody without it, like bringing your business down. Right. So that's what's so great about being, you know, us, entrepreneurs is we have some ability to be flexible.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: You just made me think about something there with when you're talking about small, scale designers being having the ability to be nimble. I've been listening to podcasts now Business podcasts for designers for a solid two years. And I've heard a lot of coaches come on, and there's a couple of things that really stick in my craw when I keep hearing it over and over again, is that designers need to be focused on always upscaling to the most luxury clients possible, like the ultra elite mansions. And I'm like, one, not everybody wants to do that and it requires certain things in your business to be able to deliver that level of service. Right.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: For sure.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And two, they'll say, well, you need to have this, your, your signature style and the way your operations are, is, is set in stone and that you will not deviate from them. And if the client doesn't agree, well, then tough for them. And I'm like, I don't think that works in real life. It sounds great on the podcast. Like we're all on team designer and we're going to make sure you don't get screwed over by your client. But that nimbleness that, that being under to understand your client and what their needs are and what they want out of this project and all that kind of stuff and the way you're describing sales is something completely different to that message that I'm hearing. I mean, maybe I just, I'm pumping your tires here a little bit because, I mean, I'm just, I really like the approach you're bringing.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Thank you. I will say that's very common. You know, I often get told like here, here's a perfect example of like a sales or business coach. They will say this. I might get your designers into an uproar that are listening of what I'm about to say. But here's one of the things that when I think about sales, I, when I'm coaching, right. As a coach, as a sales coach, if I'm coaching a designer, I am going to give advice based on what I think is going to be best for their client so their client has the best experience so they have the opportunity to earn that business and earn repeat business and earn referral business. So I'm always thinking about it from their client's perspective. Now, the short approach of this and, I don't mean to bash anybody because this is, that's not what I'm about. But a lot of coaches and business people love to give advice that sounds really good to their buyer. And in this case, the, the buyer is the designer. And so it's like, you know, you can, you can pay a lot of money for someone to say, like, oh, well, here's this, you know, here's this thing. And you know, you're gonna, like, value yourself, like, know your worth. And like, you know, another, like, piece of sales advice that frankly drives me nuts is for someone to say, well, in sales, you just have to follow up. That is a nothing burger. Like, unless you can tell me what to write, which I do for my clients. Unless you can explain the follow up process and what's happening in the conversation and understand the situation of, like, what kind of follow up should this actually be? Then just follow up is, it might sound good, but it doesn't move the needle. And so here's one again, I said I was going to say something that can be pretty controversial is I believe you should have pricing on your website. This will throw people into a spin. And most business coaches say, don't put pricing on your website. No, get on the phone with those people. Establish your value. Okay, I understand why they say that, but it's crappy advice. And here's why. Because you're a buyer who goes to your website and doesn't see any pricing. They don't go like, oh, gosh, this person's probably so valuable. I should just get on the phone with them and I should, I should let them establish their value. They go, no pricing. Moving on. What's the next designer in town? Do they have pricing on their website? Because it's not for your benefit. It's for the client's benefit. It's for your, your buyer's benefit. So, you know, don't take advice from people who are, like, giving you stuff that's like, placating, like, make you sound good. I never want somebody who's like, I'm just gonna pat you on the head, Nikki, and tell you how great you are. I'm not gonna pay you for that. I'm gonna pay you for saying, like, hey, Nikki, here's some things you're missing. Here's your blind spots. These are the things that are gonna move the needle in your business so you actually make more money. That's what you should be paying for. So, yeah. So I feel like you and I are on the same page about this, like, this advice around, like, know your worth and, you know, don't be flexible on your, on your process at all. It's like, okay, how does that work in parenting? I'm not a parent, but how does that kind of advice work in parenting? Like, every kid is the exact same. Treat them all the same and talk to them all the Same. Give them all the same rules. Give them all the same food, and if they don't like that food, make them eat it anyway. And if they're allergic to that food, make them eat it anyway. That's a. Essentially what they're telling you to do with your clients. And it's crappy advice because not all clients are the same. Not all clients are going to be influenced by this message or that message. Flexibility. Again, back to what I teach. There was a soapbox moment for me.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Oh, no, for sure. I agree 100%. I mean, if. If you're a coach and, and you're a coach of interior designers, what is the purpose? To make the designer feel good about themselves or to make their clients, you know, their prospective clients turn into actual clients and help them build a business that, they can be proud of and fill their bank accounts up and have a, you know, the life they want. Like, that's the goal, right?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. I mean, I'm not ashamed to admit in any stretch of imagination that, my goal is for my clients to make more money so that they make. They get to work with more of their ideal clients so they make more of an impact in the world, not just in their business, but in their families and in their communities, and that comes from making money. So I'm not going to give you advice that sounds good to you. I'm going to give you advice that will move the needle, and I'm going to give you structure and strategy and language to do that, because otherwise, like, you know, I one time asked somebody who had achieved a really high level of success, and I asked her a very specific question about a process that she was doing with her podcast. So as podcasters, I think, you know, it's like somebody's achieved a really high level of success at their podcast. Like, I asked her a very specific question, and her answer back to me was, nikki, just pretend you're famous and people will believe you. And I was like, that is the worst piece of advice and a, nothing burger that anybody has given me before. And I'm sure her intention was good. She was a nice person. And, you know, she is successful. But, like, okay, that just says to me, she can't articulate to me what her process is. Totally fine. That she doesn't know what her process is. But if. Or she's not willing to share it, and either. Either way is fine. But telling somebody to just pretend that they're this and that's going to make all the difference in their business is, like, it's a nothing burger. Don't pay money for it.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: All right, I want to switch, to, I. Before, I, when I knew I was going to have you on the podcast, I contacted a whole bunch of designers and say, okay, I'm having Nikki Roush on. Do, you have any questions for. I figured why not? Right?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: I love that.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And the, and, and my number one question is how important is follow up to the sales process, which we just discussed.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: So I guess, I guess we can, we can say we've covered that.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Well, can I add something to it? Because here's where the follow up falls down. And this is, this is the piece that I teach, right. Is that if you're going to have a great consultation discovery call, sales call with a prospective buyer and you agree to put together a proposal for them or scope of work, and you're going to send it over for them to review. Here's the most important thing that you do is you schedule a time to review it with them. And this is where the follow up happens. Right. So we're gonna, so I'll have that to you on Thursday. Let's schedule a time to talk Friday morning. Do you have your calendar available? Does 10am work for you? Great. Let's get it on our calendars. You'll have it Thursday night so you can look it over, and Friday we'll walk through it together and I'll answer any questions you have about it and then we'll talk about next steps for working together. That's the first most important thing. Now if they say, just send me the scope of work and I'll look it over and I'll let you know. Okay, so now you have to decide how much follow up you're going to do. So follow up is crucial, but how you do it and how you schedule it. Because again, balance of power in the conversation. If you just act like I'm going to chase you, I'm just going to chase you and chase you and chase you. I always say if you act like you're going to chase people, they turn into toddlers. I don't know if you've ever been around a toddler before, but you get around a toddler and you go, I'm going to chase you. The toddler doesn't even know why we're playing the game, but they're in and they start running, right? And then what happens when you get tired or you decide you're not going to chase anymore? The toddler will start to, like, inch their way back to see like, what's going on or they'll go find a new thing to play with. Right. So you should not be chasing clients. You should have a process that's respectful of both of your times of as far as like the follow up goes. So that means you offering to schedule and encouraging this next time we're going to chat. And even if they're like, thank you for the proposal, I looked it over, I need to talk to my spouse about it. Great. When we have that conversation, let's schedule another time so I can answer any questions for you. And as long as they stay in it with me, I will stay in it with them. And I don't care if it takes a year or two years to earn somebody's business, I'll stay in it. But if they're like, like, just follow up with me when you feel like it. Now they're saying like, just chase me. I'm gonna act like a toddler. And I'm like, no, I'm not gonna chase.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, with, residential design, we quite frequently have to deal with multiple decision makers. How do we deal with that? I mean, if we're, we're trying to, to, you know, peel these details out of the, I mean, I don't want to, you know, generalize, but I mean, if it's a family home, it's more than likely going to be the the woman who is making most of the decisions. I mean, but we've had that numerous times. When the husband gets involved, it, it tends to complicate matters a little bit. So any advice on, on dealing with two decision makers?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. So first and foremost in your questions, you always want to ask, and this is the way you frame it, you don't say like, are you the decision maker? That's a terrible question. A better question is, whom besides yourself will be involved in the decision making process? Then you wait, you see what they say. So if they say my husband or, you know, my wife is going to be involved, or you know, my parents are giving me money and we're going to, you know, they want to be involved with whatever, whatever the answer is. Now your next question is what is the best way to get, to get us all on the same page? Like, could we set up a time where we could all chat together? Is that a possibility? So I'm asking as a question what I'm not doing. As the designer is saying, well then we need to have a meeting where we're all on the Call together because that essentially says to that person, like, you're not important. I want them to know that they're important and I also want everybody else involved. Now if the spouse gets involved and they have some concerns that didn't come up in the initial consultation, your job is to address those. Your job is to ask the right questions, to find out what are the hesitations and see if you can overcome them. And again, this is conditional, close question. You might bring that into the conversation so that we can understand, like, how can we move forward? Is there a possibility? And if it's just down to like, there's nothing you could do, I'm not going to spend the money on this. My wife wants this. I don't. Then here's the hard truth about ideal clients. Somebody can only be an ideal client for you if they're willing to spend the money to hire you. Otherwise they're not an ideal client. So I don't care how great the spouse is, but if the other spouse is like, doesn't matter what your price is, I'm not going to pay you. They are not a client. Bless and release, move on.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And frequently, or all too frequently, you'll have the spouses arguing, you know, as soon as the meetings are done or the phone calls you've got off, the, the phone calls, they're, they're going back and forth debating the points and then the designer thinks that they've left things on a positive note. Meanwhile, you know, they're arguing back and forth. So if you don't get those details out of, you know, whoever has a stake in this. Right. You're setting yourself up for trouble.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, I mean, don't be afraid to ask somebody like, what, what are your hesitations? What are your concerns about moving forward with this project? And wait and see what they say. That's a perfect opportunity for them to say, well, I was never expecting to spend, you know, $150,000 on a, you know, on a designer for a remodel. Okay, so again, does that then say, well, what? My follow up question then would be like, well, what were you planning to invest? Because I want to know. And if they say nothing over a hundred thousand, then do I have a downsell offer to get them started? Because sometimes you get in there, they get the first, you know, project under the belt with you and they're like, they become your biggest advocate, your hugest fan, they'll be shouting from the rooftops how awesome you are and they'll have no problem moving forward with the Next stage.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, for sure. And I mean, it's, it's a learning process as well from, for the designer. Right. As you're asking these questions and maybe realizing that whether it's your sale, your process, like any, any part of your process, of your business, maybe there are holes. And by asking these questions, the. Your potential clients are pointing out you've got a hole here in your system. Right. And then you can go back and fix it. And, you know, even if it doesn't work for that client, it maybe works for the next one down the road, right?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yes, yes, that's such a great point. You know, one of the best things that the best offers I've ever put out into the market, my clients have designed them for me. They'll be like, you know what you should be selling, Nikki, or, you know, what I would really find valuable from you. Okay. Like, I listen to those things and I always say, like, if, if I get told something three to five times, you better believe it's becoming an offer or it's becoming a podcast episode, or it's because, like, when, if I get the same question, three to five like it, it's such great feedback. And the way that you get that is by putting yourself in, in conversations with prospective clients, like, you're just building muscles. So even if you feel uncomfortable about the conversations, the more reps you get under your belt, the easier it gets.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: 100%. Next question was about referrals and, interior design being like a super referral heavy business. But, these designers almost to a person were saying, you know, we don't have a plan for soliciting referrals or, or repeat work. And I'm like, how can you not. Is that something that you help your clients out with, like coming up with a process to do that?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, like finding the process that works the best for you. But here's the, here's the basics of every process is you have to ask. And it's not because people don't want to refer you. It's just because they, they're not thinking about you. They're thinking about themselves. They're thinking about what are they going to have for dinner or what bill do they have to pay or what's, you know, what's the kids schedule and where do they have to be at what time. So unless you plan the seed by asking the question, the chance of you getting a referral are slim to none. Now, having a consistent process of staying front of mind is also important, and there's lots of Ways you can do that. For some of my clients, we do that through their newsletter. For others, we actually have like a program that they send out, you know, a card with a little like refer a friend. Like, you know, here's a whatever, a half price consultation call or whatever just to get the process started. And for every designer it might be a little bit different, but yeah, referrals, like again, you know, repeat business is the easiest business to earn. And the second easiest is referral business if you do it well because you get to ride the coattails of the credibility of the person who's referring you. Right. Like somebody who reaches out to me blind is probably not going to get a response. But somebody who reaches out and is referred by a trusted colleague of mine or a trusted friend, friend of mine, I'm going to pay attention to that. And the same will be true with your referrals. When their friend is referring them or somebody they trust is saying like, this is the designer, you know, we, we recommend her highly or him highly for this and that. Like that, that carries weight. It matters.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah. The idea that a designer should wait for that past client to have some discussion with a neighbor or a friend or something and they're saying, you know, I've been thinking about renovating my kitchen. They're like, I got the designer for you. I'm like, that does happen like 100%. But it's like, why would you not want to, you know, keep your face, you know, in their world a little bit? Right?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Oh yeah, Right.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. Even if it's, you know, I just. We had, I had a designer client actually where we did this thing where she a couple times a year sends out these really cool little postcards and that has resulted in business just these little postcards to her past clients that, you know, they, each one has talked about something different, but it's been like helpful and useful and it's colorful and it's, you know, got a beautiful image of something like some piece of work that she's done, just even that of like staying front of mind with people and you go like direct, mail. Like nobody likes direct mail. Well, not a lot of people are doing direct mail in this kind of business anymore. And so it does make you stand out for in, in her, in her realm, in her marketplace. It definitely makes her stand out. And she's working with very high end clients, so they're still seeing it.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And with residential designers, I mean, realistically, how many clients in a year of like full design projects. Does a designer actually have. If you did handwritten letters, for crying out loud, you could bang that out over a weekend. Right. And nobody gets mail anymore?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Like, no, nobody gets organized.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: No. All I get in my mailbox are, are not even bills anymore. All I get is flyers. That's all I get in my mailbox. If I was to receive a letter from somebody that would stand up.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yes, I got one yesterday that looked like a letter. And then I looked at it and I was like, oh, this actually isn't a letter. This is. This is a, you know, it is an ad. But, but it caught my attention and I had a huge stack of mail, and that's the one thing I went and grabbed because it looked like it was a handwritten note, but it turned out it actually wasn't, but it, it caught my attention enough to slow me down to look at it.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, yeah, for sure. Consultations. This is another thing that, from listening to all these interior design business podcasts, it used to be that, that the first in person consultation with the client is free. Everybody did that. And then I don't know how many years ago, two or three years ago, I started hearing podcasters saying, well, you have to charge, everybody has to charge for their consultation. And now everybody charges for their consultation. Like, I've talked to designers who charge 500 for just this first meeting, just to sit down with them. I honestly don't know how I feel about doing that. So I was. This is a question I thought would be great to have you answer.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, yeah. So I definitely have worked with designers where we have figured out how to position the fee. Right. When there's a fee for it. I will say, I do believe that if you're going to charge a fee for something, there needs to be a deliverable. So they need to have walked away feeling like they got something out of the call, whether they hire you or not. Also, it's a great opportunity to, if you are charging a fee for it, that you offer them the opportunity to apply that fee towards their project with you, and you work that into the, you know, or percentage of it, depending. I have some designers that will apply 50%, I have some that apply 100%. And, you know, you get to decide. I will say again, what I really love is if that is your process and you have somebody who's pushing back on it and you are willing to make some kind of concession on it in order to earn their business, that may be the thing that you need to do to Earn their business is to make that concession on that first fee. You have to decide that, you know, and how to frame it and all of that. I can. I work with clients on how to do that, so I'm not opposed to doing it. And here's what I would say is if you feel like you're losing business because you're not giving it away for free, then it probably is time for you to revisit. You know, if the fee is causing people to be like, oh, no. You know, one of the things I always ask my designers when we talk about this is what is your. What's your conversion rate when you go on site and do, in person call. And if they have a pretty high conversion rate. Conversion rate, then I tell them you need to be flexible on that fee. Because if you have a 75% chance of earning that business, and that's a $50,000 project, and you're haggling with them over them paying a 500 fee, like, you're. What is that saying? Like, you're stepping over dollars to pick up dimes or whatever. Like, that is insane to me. You know, you have to. To do what's. What's best for you. But I find a lot of times, just if somebody pushes back and you say, well, the fee for that is $500, and they're like, what, $500? You don't do that for free. Like, I don't think we're. I don't think we want you to come on site. Then I think we'll move on to another designer. Then you have the opportunity to say, what if I was willing to. What if I was willing to split the difference and cut that fee in half? Would that make it more feasible for you? Like, oftentimes I find if I'm willing to split the difference between something for people. Now here's the thing. It's still a $50,000 project, and now they're only getting $250 applied toward. Towards it. Not the 500. Right. Like, be careful that you're not trying to stand in your place of, like, I'm an expert and I want to be valued for my, you know, let's. Let's get the business.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: No, and I think that came from a place where people were having designers come out and, and, and, you know, you're investing, you know, including driving time, probably three hours for a meeting.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And. And to say that that time doesn't have value is, Is ridiculous. And it, would set up that. That kind of power dynamic where you're the, the surf in the relationship and you know, they're calling all the shots. So I get why they did that, but it's that, it's that rigidity that drives me crazy. And I mean, use the word nimbleness and I'm like, let's go over there, be a bit more nimble and don't get. So especially when it's a small business and you've got these rigid, rigid rules. I don't understand the. And if all you did was lose one project because of that, because of being rigid to, you know, to get that five hundred, you're giving up a fifty thousand dollar project. Well, how many consultations does that? Right, yeah, that's what, that's 100 consultations, right?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, yeah. That's insane, right? I would say the, you know what I found to be true is the person who has the most flexibility in a conversation has the most influence. So this idea of being nimble in a conversation and being willing to be flexible, it allows for you to have more influence. Now I'm not saying like, well, they said they didn't like my fee, so I just, you know, I cut it in half. Like that's not what I'm saying. Like there needs to be. I actually don't believe in discounting your fee unless you get something in return. So offering discounts and things like that, and I'm not opposed to those, however, I won't do it for nothing. I have to get something in return because again, it creates a balance of power. Right? So if you're just giving, giving, giving and making concession after concession after concession, then you're not, you know, like they're not going to value you. But if I say I'm willing to waive that fee, if you're willing to agree that, you know, you'll sign the contract on site for us to work together, you know, you're going to make a decision on site. Okay, well now I'm willing to waive my fee to get a $50,000 gig. Like, okay, I'll do that. So, you know, like that's the idea of like you want to have influence in the conversation and sometimes it's just learning to like, what could I say here that would offer some wiggle room for me and for them so they feel like they got a win and I'm getting ultimately what I want here, which is to earn their business.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And in a way that, that, that consultation fee now becomes transformed from this, almost like purity test of like, you know, you're going to respect who I am as a designer to becoming a negotiating tool. Right. Like, if you went into it thinking, I don't really care about this $500, I'm, I'm happy to play with that and we can use that if that gets me to sign the contract right away. Why would I not do that?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, yeah. So again, it's just learning how to add a little flexibility and you know, being nimble in your business when you're a small business owner, like, there's some real advantages. And that's one of our advantages of being a small business owner is that we have the ability to be flexible. You know, when you're working for somebody. You know, when I was working at the largest manufacturer that I worked for and closing multimillion dollar deals for them, there were times where I would have to walk away from business because it didn't fit the company's policies. But yet, if I could go to my boss and if I could get him to allow me to make some kind of concession, I could earn the business. And then, you know, I was their top producing rep in North America and, and they were like, wow, you know, like, how, how have you done this and how have you done that? Well, because I'm not trying to just follow, like, just because you have a rule doesn't mean it fits for everyone.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, yeah. And you got to look at the, at the cost benefit. Right? You're gonna stick to the purity of that rule and, and forego a fantastic piece of business.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: The next question was about, how to quickly identify potential clients, to more from the point of view of finding clients that aren't going to work for you and like moving on from them quickly. Is there a way within your five step process and like how we can kind of get to that?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. So it is going to be in the questions that you ask. So I know sometimes for designers they'll put in place, like when somebody goes to, to like schedule a complimentary call with you, you might have a questionnaire that they answer. And one of the questions I always like, I will push back with my designers on that questionnaire and making sure that it's short and to the point and gets the basic information they need to decide whether or not they want to get on a call with somebody. So one of the things that you could do, and this is a common thing that designers will ask in their, you know, in their questionnaire before someone gets on a call with them is like, what's your budget. And people will be like, I don't know. But then they get on a call with somebody and it's like, well, now I'm getting on the call with all these tire kickers. They were never going to hire me because, you know, so one of the things we'll do is we'll frame the question. Like typically a project, you know, a three, you know, a three bedroom or a three room design runs between X and Y. Where do you fall in that range? So now if they don't fall within that range and you know that like anybody who, you know is showing up saying, well, I was just looking to spend $5,000 on my designer and you know, like, that's not even in the ballpark, right. Then you can bless and release very quickly and you can send a really nice message and say, you know, based on where you are and based with your budget, it doesn't look like this is a good fit. So as to not waste your time, let's go ahead and cancel this call. Right then I've just blessed and released. I didn't have to get on a call to tell them, like, I'm not interested in your $5,000 project.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, for sure. And, and definitely before we, we talk about having an in person meeting, like, we don't want to let it get to that, to that stage.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: No. So there are certain questions that you want to know, like, what is your, you know, think about what qualifies somebody right off the bat as a potential buyer for you? Those are the questions that you might ask. And when I say those are the questions, I'm going to say you're not allowed to ask more than five. But I'd like it to be less than I'd like it to be three or less for. To schedule a consultation call. Because if you're asking somebody, I had a designer one time who hired me and she was like, nobody's filling this out. And you know, I'm really struggling to get clients. And when I looked at our form, I was like, it would take somebody an hour to fill out your intake form and you're asking them questions that you don't need the answers to until they actually hire you. That is a waste of their time and frankly, a waste of yours. So we got to get all these questions off it. And as soon as we did, it was like this three question thing. And then people started actually answering the questions, getting on calls with her, and she had the opportunity to earn their business. But this like, tell me everything about Your project. Tell me everything about your dreams. Where do you want to be in 10 years? Like, all that stuff that is garbage that does not belong in a discovery question questionnaire, for sure.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Nikki, can you tell us a little bit about your background and how you got into doing what you're doing and why you enjoy doing it?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, thank you for asking. So my background is as a professional salesperson. So I was in the technology space selling to large corporations for many, many years of my career and had a lot of success there. And one of the things that I did while working as, you know, regional sales manager at the manufacturer level is I started studying neuro linguistic programming. If that's a new term to you or to any of the listeners. It's really the study of communication. I started studying it because I thought, oh, it'll make the selling process easier for me. I'm an introvert. I worked in a very male dominated field and I worked with I primarily almost always worked with other, like my coworkers were always men salespeople so they had that more like stronger energy and it just didn't fit my style. So I started studying nlp thinking like, oh, this is going to really allow me to kind of develop my own style. And it certainly did. And it helped me in a lot of other areas of my life as well, improving my overall communication. So when I decided to start my own business back in 2013, it was with this idea of bringing my background in sales, my background in neuro linguistic programming, combining those and teaching people how to have more effective sales conversations. I really find that a lot of people struggle with the actual live conversation or even the written conversation. And that's a place where I feel like I can step in and make an impact in somebody's business. And so sales maven was really formed out of this idea of wanting to teach people how to get more comfortable with the sales process. So that's what I do now.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Okay. So that nlp, if, correct me if I'm wrong, that's, that's Tony Robbins, right. That's like the big name associated with, with nlp.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Well, he, he, he does teach nlp and the founders are John Grinder, and Richard Bandler. And he was a student of somebody who was probably a student and a student and a student. You know, it's, it's been around for, for quite a, quite a time. So he has a version of NLP of what he does. And for sure, and he's probably, he probably is one of the most recognizable names out there.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Okay, and just could you give us like a, I don't know, 30 seconds probably is too short. But just a brief idea of what NLP is and how you use it.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, so first of all, it stands for Neuro Linguistic Programming. So neuro is how you process information in your brain. And the linguistics piece is the language. So that is not only how you speak to others, but how others speak to you. And picking up patterns. Also any internal dialogue that you've got going on, that is the language piece of it. And then the programming part is about habits and patterns. And so when you learn your style and you're able to start picking up somebody else's style of the way they process and the way they speak, and any kind of habits or patterns, you can adjust your style to put the other person at ease. So how I teach it and how I bring it into my work is I always wrap it around my all time favorite quote, which is, blessed are the flexible, for they shall not be bent out of shape. And so what I think I teach and the, the goal is to teach people how to have more flexibility in their conversation. Because if you show up in a conversation and you're like, this is me, take it or leave it. Like, you know, this is my style, that might be fine in some instances, but in other instances it'll be a real turn off from, you know, for how somebody else's style is. Or it'll just be a mismatch. And so it will cause them to want to go work with somebody else or talk to somebody else, or it'll be harder for them to be in conversation. And the goal is to make it as easy as possible for people to be in conversation. And the easier you make kind of results in three things happening. The person will stay in conversation with you longer, they'll be more revealing about how to earn their business. And the third thing that will happen when you can adjust your style to put the other person at ease is they'll also be more interested and open to hearing what it is that you have to share. So, you know, it's not about being manipulative, it's about being flexible. It's about allowing somebody to be in a conversation in a comfortable way with you. And when you make it comfortable and conversational, the conversation gets easier. Not just for you, but frankly, it's all about the client. So it gets easier for the prospective client. And so again, that's what I teach is how do you add some flexibility to your behavior to make it easier for someone to be in conversation with you?

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Do you find that some of your clients are maybe more naturally talented, in that regard? Like, it just. They. They adopt to this. This nlp, or maybe they already kind of do that in, in their conversations. And then other people are a bit more resistant and a bit more stiff, and they find this difficult.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: I find that, yeah, some people have developed a skill set, and so for them, they don't really have to think about it too much. Like, it comes. It's. It. It's not. It's actually not natural. It's something they've learned how to do over time. But just like anything you get really good at, you don't really have to think that much about it anymore, right? Like breathing. You have to learn to breathe, but you do it and you don't really it, right? And like, certain things, like some people are really good at playing an instrument. They can pick it up, they can play, and it doesn't really seem like a big deal, but it took them a lot to learn it, right? And so there are skills I truly believe that anybody can learn to sell successfully. I think there's a misconception that you're either born with this natural charisma and you'll be really good at sales and it'll be easy for you. And maybe that's kind of true for some people. Just like some people are born with like, natural talent, right? Like a pitcher. I don't know if you are sporting sports person, but, you know, like somebody who, you know, who can throw a good fast pitch. But they still have coaches, they still learn, they still perfect their technique. And with sales, anybody can learn to do it and do it well. It's just there's a skill set and you start to build this muscle and it gets easier and easier over time. So, yes, some people show up and they're just like, well, I just want, you know, to convince people to buy from me, Nikki. And I just want people to understand me and the way that I show up, well, okay. Except that a buyer has a choice in the marketplace and there's many choices, right? There's many interior designers in the place where they live or their expertise. Just like there's a million sales coaches out there, right? We want to connect. We want to give our money to somebody who we feel like is invested in us and our success. So your buyers, they want to hire the designer that they feel connected to, that they feel like listens to them, that asks them smart questions. And so that's the piece that I'm teaching. And when people are willing to add some flexibility to their behavior, when they're willing to stretch themselves and learn a little bit more about how do you say something in a way that lands softly versus saying something in a way that raises the, hair on the back of somebody's neck? Right. Like, I truly believe you can say just about anything to anybody. It's the how you say it that really matters. So I teach a lot of, how do you phrase things? How do you ask questions? What should those questions, like, how should they be framed? And the impact that it makes with the other person?

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: When I was much, much younger and just graduated university, all through university I had trained university, athletes. And so, I didn't want to go and work a real job at first, so I went to work at a local gym as a personal trainer. And then I graduated to selling because I did well, I had lots of clients. And so the, the manager said, well, I want you to try to do both. And he gave me these scripts to follow and pros and cons, they were horrible. Like they were. It was, it felt so greasy and manipulative and horrible. Like I was just trying to make people feel bad about them themselves so that I could swoop in and save the day. On the other hand, following, I mean, I didn't follow the scripts to the letter. I just couldn't do that. But, I sucked at. At first, I was horrible. But over time, you know, maybe a period of three months, I got much better, more comfortable at selling. So I think you're like 100 correct in that it's a skill that you could learn because I was terrible at it. And yeah, After a little while, it became comfortable. And then, you know, I never followed his scripts from then on. And then I started my own business and I never had the people who work for me ever do that kind of thing. But they did have to learn how to sell.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, There really is a structure and a process and this is very nlp. There's a presupposition in nlp, and it says there's a structure to excellence. So anybody who's achieving a high level of success in some area of their life or their business, if you really dig in and ask the right questions, you'll start to see that there is a structure. Now, most of the time, their structure lives in what's known as the unconscious competence. It becomes so second nature to them that they don't really think much about it. But there really is a structure. And you can start to break that down a little bit by asking the questions and by understanding a structure and a process. It allows for you to then apply that in your own way to your own life or business so that you can achieve exceptional results. So I teach a lot of structure, but I don't teach a lot of like, okay, here's a script, and you just read it. Because at that point, especially now in our current day and age, like. Like, you can teach AI a script, but it still really struggles with that human connection piece of, like, making adjustments on the fly. And. And that's the piece that. That's you. That brings the brilliance of you to the conversation. So when you understand the structure, great, you can follow it. But. And I do offer scripts to people, but it's really just a starting point because I can say something that would land fine with somebody else, but you might say it and they might be offended and vice versa, right? Like, you have a way about you that you could say something to somebody and they would go like, wow, I really appreciate the way you said that. Now, if I said it, they'd be like, dang, what's her problem? She's a real, like, kind of hard to deal with, right? So it's learning how to apply the structure to your own style. So I always say, I don't teach people how to sell like me, because I'm me and you don't want to be me. Like, I already got that one handled, right? You want to sell like you. You just want to be strategic in it. You want to be more comfortable with it. You want to be more nimble, right? And so that you can handle these things that come at you. And when you understand the structure, it allows you to continue to move to that place where we actually exchange dollars for services or dollars for product or whatever that is. And that's the whole point of sales, is to, like, the end game, right? But doing it in a way that the other person is really comfortable in the conversation. They're happy to be in the conversation. They're engaged in the conversation, and they're willing to give up those dollars to work with you or to take advantage of your expertise or services.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: What does that process look like? If I was a, new client of yours and you started training me on this, I got to assume there's a certain amount of fear coming from them, a certain amount of, oh, I don't think I can do this. And you, you know, because you've, you know, worked with so many different people, you know, it's like, don't worry. We're gonna get you through this. So. So what does that look like for the. For the new client?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, so I do teach a signature. I have my signature framework for a sales process, and I call it the Selling Staircase. I actually wrote my third book around it. And the reason I teach it as a staircase is because there are five steps in this process. And most people understand that if you're going to ascend a staircase, you're going to go one step at a time. Right? You don't stand at the bottom of a staircase and hop up to the top, and you certainly wouldn't walk up to somebody. Now, this might be different for you with your background as a personal trainer at the gym, but, you know, you don't walk up to somebody who is. Who doesn't even know the context of the conversation and say, hey, from a standing position, can you hop from this bottom step? Five steps, they'll look at you like, oh, you're crazy. I'm not going to do that. I might bang my shins. I might. Now, some people might like, oh, I'll accept the challenge because I have a really strong core. But most people are going to look at you like, thanks. No, thanks. So the reason I teach it as a staircase is because if you know what step you're on in the conversation, it then allows you to know, what do I do or say next to guide the person to the next step. So it isn't about going in for that hard sale and, like, pushing somebody or, you know, like, trying to make somebody feel bad about themselves so they'll buy from you. It's more about, like, here's a process. You can follow it. There's a. It's conversational. And so we work on what are the steps that. That they struggle with. Right. Some people show up and they're like, I make a really good first impression. Great. Because that's step one is the, you know, the introduction step, making a powerful first impression. And then other people, which is step two, most people struggle with. This step is about creating curiosity. That's step two in my process. And when I ask people, do you know how to create curiosity? When you're talking about your business, your service, your podcast, whatever it is, they look at me like, what now? What do you mean, create curiosity? But if you're not able to create curiosity, oftentimes you, you don't pique somebody's interest enough for them to even continue down that road with you. So you never get the chance to earn their business because they don't even know, like, what you know or how you could, how you could help them in some way. So they just move on to the next thing, right? That's calling for their attention. Step three in the process, that is the discovery. I'm really breaking this down. I hope that's okay. The process. Okay.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Love it.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Step three, I called discovery. Now, a lot of people refer to this step as the consultation, the sales step. I don't actually care what you call it. What I care is, do you do it well? And so what I teach there is what are the questions that you're asking in that conversation? Now most people think, oh, I have to show up on a sales call and I have to be on. I have to like, convince this person to buy from me. I have to tell them how great I am. I have to show them all the work and all the things I've done before so that they're so enamored with me that they hire me. Like, no, that's not it at all. It's really about finding out what's going on for this person. Do they have a need? And based on the questions I'm asking, I'm able to establish that, yes, I might have a solution for them. And then the third thing that's happening here is do I have permission to put an offer in front of them? And when those things are in place, then the conversation is super easy to Move them to step four, which is proposal. This is where you're laying out a scope of work or you're delivering a proposal to somebody, or maybe you're just through conversation saying, you know, the logical next step is for us to do an on site consult call, you know, and the fee for that is this right? And is that something you'd like to move forward with? So proposal step four, And then step five goes really closely with step four. And that's the close and it is the second most missed step in the process. So I need to understand when a client is working with me or coming to work with me, what steps are they? They're good, they're, they're fine, they're comfortable, they're working really well. What steps do they not feel as comfortable or confident on? Sometimes it's all five, sometimes it's just one of the steps, sometimes it's three or four. Right. And so through that we're going to work on strategy and structure and language that makes that step more comfortable for them so they're more confident in the conversation. Because the other thing is, you know, the worst thing in the world is to think, you know, I'm going to make this big investment and redesign my home and I'm going to hire a designer. And, and they don't seem very confident in what they're doing. They don't seem confident about their offer. Like I'm not going to give my money, that's hard earned money to somebody who's not confident. And it's not even that they're not confident about the delivery of what they're capable of. It's usually they're not confident in the sales process, but it translates as if they're not comfortable like actually delivering. And then therefore they're going to miss out on getting to work with that client and the client's going to miss out on what's so great about that designer and all the things that that designer can bring to them, into their experience, into their home or to their commercial workspace or whatever that is that they're having them design.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Do you find that with designers, specifically there are any of those five steps that are the hardest for them to get and really nail down? I mean when you said number five, like asking for the, for the sale, and I just smiled to myself and I'm like, I remember that when I ran my fitness training business is these trainers would like have everything lined up and then they wouldn't ask for the sale. And I'm like, you have to ask for the sale. You got like, how do you expect to. Yeah. So, so going back, are are there any of those five steps that are like the hardest or the easiest for you to help designers with or are we all just completely different?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Well, no, I would say with designers I, will say and I've worked with a lot of Designers over the years, they often struggle with step three, which is the discovery, because they're not asking the right questions and they've got this process that oftentimes is turning people off and pushing them away. They definitely struggle with the close. And even, I will say, they even struggle oftentimes with how to lay out a proposal in a compelling way that makes it easy for the person to say yes. So with designers in particular, I will say I often work on the questions they're asking in their discovery process, how they're laying out their proposal. What does the proposal even look like? Like, we go in and edit those and make sure that, that it's ready, it's compelling, it's easy for somebody to understand what they're looking at. It looks professional. I just did this with a really successful, architect where, you know, she showed me her proposal and she's like, I feel like I'm missing out on business. And that's proposal. I just don't think it's doing me any justice. And just by looking at it, I could see like, here' things we want to make some tweaks to immediately. And these 10 things weren't huge, but they make a huge difference. And now. Well, one, she's so much more confident when she's presenting her proposals now. And the proposal is so much easier for the client to know what's going on in there, where the information is, how to determine what they're actually going to pay for something. So it's an easier close now. It's an easier. Yes. So I don't know. Did I answer your question? I feel like I went off a little bit. Okay.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: No, no. I love tangents.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Okay, good.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: I, I want to come back to step three.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And where I always found, interior design to be kind of a unique business is that it's obviously a luxury service. Right. Like, it doesn't matter at what level if you're getting your, your home renovated. Like, that's a significant chunk of money for anybody, right?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: But interior design, residential interior design is, is an industry dominated by, solo designers, small team designers. Like, I mean, my numbers could be off now since the last time I checked, but it was about 85% of designers have less than four employees counting themselves. And, and I believe that those numbers actually lumped in commercial design as well. So residential is even more skewed. So you've got these very small businesses selling this very expensive product slash service. And it's highly personal. Right. If I go out and buy like a super expensive sports car. Right. That's a lot of money. But, the people selling me that super expensive sports car, odds are, are trained to sell. Right. Like the company themselves. Let's put money into that.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And I mean, it's not really as personal. I realize there are car people out there, but I mean, your home is something different on a whole level of being personal. Right.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: So you've got those things kind of working against the designer. Right. Where they haven't been trained. And your idea of it's not about what you can do for them, it's about pulling out what they need. And they may not even know what they need because they've never worked with a designer before. Right. They don't understand the process. So I can see that if you're not good at that, it's going to be a tough road for you as a designer to, you know, sell clients on your services and yourself.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. If you don't know how to ask the right questions in the right way, like just even understanding questions. And as a matter of fact, before we started this recording, I had mentioned that I was. I have a designer client right now who she, I've spent all morning kind of doing some edits to just her communication, her email communication with prospective clients and tweaking those for her. But one of the things in her message, I didn't share this with you, but one of the first lines in her message is like, Nikki, I now understand at such a deep level that the way I ask questions and the question I'm asking makes all the difference. She's like, I can't believe that all these years I've been doing this and not having these questions and feeling frustrated. Right. Like I'm expanding here on another conversation her and I had. But, like all these times I've had these conversations where I wasn't really getting any kind of a response, I wasn't getting anything back. And she now realizes it's because she wasn't asking the right questions. Questions are game changing in a sales process. And understanding there. I always say there are two types of questions. There's your, like, criteria questions, which is helping you determine whether or not you're speaking to, an ideal client. You know, do, again, do they have a need and do you have a solution for them? And then the second type of questions are what I call your expertise questions. These are the ones that instead of you having to feel like, oh, I got to be on. I've got to impress this Person I have to, you know, give them my, my, all my, like, feeds and speeds and my background and all my projects that I've worked on. You can actually, with using smart questions, you can start to plant seeds with your expertise. Questions of like, dang, this person really knows what they're talking about. Wow. They're asking me questions. And, and it's. What it's doing is it's causing the brain of the buyer to be going, like, I really need to work with this designer because they're pulling things out of me that I didn't even know yet that was important. And now that I, now that they ask this question, I see how this is. This is instrumental to me making this decision. This is going to make a difference in the project and how it is delivered. And so the questions you ask are so crucial. And if nobody has ever trained you about questions, then let me tell you, it's going to make a difference in your business for sure.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: I'm a big believer in, I mean, I guess I read about it first with Story brand, like a number of years ago, Donald Miller. But then even into, like, if you look at Story, everybody, I mean, you know, they say that, you know, everyone's favorite word is their own name. And we like, we like to think that we are the hero in our story. Right. And to me, in, in this process with the designer and their client, you. You make the, the client the. The hero of the story by asking them all these questions about themselves, about their lives, about what they want out of this possible renovation, how they see, you know, their life being different after it. And. And then you, the designer is the, the guide or the Sherpa or the. Whatever, the person taking them from here to here. And, and that just ties exactly. Into questions as opposed to statements or.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, I can do this. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Be more fun once you get it. Like you're saying about your client, how they're. They click for them. And I'm sure they, in addition to being more successful, it's probably more enjoyable, these interactions with new clients.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. Because the other thing is the person asks, here's a little secret for you. The person asking questions actually holds the power in a conversation. Now, I do believe that in any sales conversation, there should be a balance of power. So you don't get to hold all the power because, frankly, they'll feel less than. And your client will go buy from someone else. You don't want them to give all the power because they won't value you and they won't want to pay your rates and they won't. They won't really want to take your advice or they'll mistreat you, frankly. So there always needs to be a balance of power. But when you are the person asking questions, you actually are holding the power right then in the conversation. So it does help put you on an equal playing field with a prospective client when you're asking the question. So questions again like. And it does pull things out and it allows for you to really get to the heart of the matter, what's most important. Because even if you've been in business for a long time, you know, I always say there are two things that people do in sales that are so detrimental. And we all do it, by the way, is the first thing is we project our limiting beliefs onto other people. So we think like, oh, well, I've talked to hundreds of clients and they all want this, so I'm just going to talk to this person about that. Well, now you're just projecting a limiting belief onto that person. And that actually may not be case case. And then the second thing that we do that's super detrimental is we hallucinate. We act as if we can read this person's mind. So we try to anticipate this is what they're thinking, this is how they're going to respond, this is what they, this is what they're going to say, this is, this is how they feel about X, Y and Z. But I don't know if you've ever been in a conversation with somebody who is telling you all the things about yourself, but they don't actually know you how off putting that is, right? Like somebody just comes up to you at a party and they, you know, put their hand on your arm and they're like, let me tell you everything about you. And you kind of think like, ew, no, no thanks. Like you don't know me. And it kind of puts your defense up, right? So the last thing you want to do in a sales conversation is show up with all this anticipation of like, oh, I'm just gonna spew this at them and say that to them. Because that's what I say to everybody. It's like, well, that doesn't feel conversational. That just feels like if you're talking at people, they're gonna tune out. Like we're talked at all day long. You gotta talk with people. And I say with sales, sales isn't something you do to somebody, it's something you do with them. And that means that it's conversational. That means that questions are happening, that there's an exchange, that it's a real back and forth. Because if there isn't, they don't need you. If they can just go somewhere and hit play, you know, on a video and get the answers to all their design questions, that's what they'll do. I mean, YouTube's out there. There's all kinds of ways to get resources. But if they want to have a real conversation with a real human, you need to show up as a real human. That means you need to understand how to ask questions.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And you'd be right to assume that it's not. It's not just this process wouldn't help you just find the right clients, but it would also help you identify the wrong clients. Right. And so you can gracefully bow out of that project.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yes, I was. No, I mean, you know, it's so important that in a, in a consultation that you are able to identify pretty quickly. Am I talking to an ideal client? And if not, how can I. I always call it bless and release. How can I bless and release this person? One, to not waste their time, but not to waste mine. And to make sure that we leave the conversation feeling good about the conversation, but also like, like, I'm not going to spend any more time on this. Like, I'm moving on to who is a real potential client and. Or you don't want to bring people into your business that, you know. And, we've probably all done this. I know I have to. You know, you bring someone into the business thinking, like, I'll try to make it work, and then they become this nightmare client that you're like, I'm spending so much time and energy, I'm losing money every time we talk. And I feel like pulling my hair out when I work with them. Right. Like, we don't want those in our, in our business because it gets into our mindset, it starts to, like, wear away. Like, it like, wears us thin to the point where we're like, I'm burnt out. I don't even know if I want to do this anymore. I don't even know if I like design anymore. And it's like, you do you like design? You just are working with people who are exhausting you. So let's, let's fix that too. Let's bless and release those people as fast as possible.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And, the last five years, I mean, I would say since COVID the last five years, I mean, for everybody. But as interior designers, it has been like almost schizophrenic and like just insane amount of work while everybody, you know, was working from home. And, and this past year, I mean, it's not true across the board, but I've spoken with like way too many designers who have said that their pipeline has completely emptied and they're more than a little nervous. So I'm wondering how your sales process would help with that. Where it feels like they need to make every sale. Right. You know, and we don't want to say yes to these wrong clients. But, but still, when there's less people looking to have their homes renovated and that pressure of being able to convert those people to clients. Could you offer any advice?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. So, and I will say this, I'm seeing this across the board, not just in design, but with, with all of my clients. Right. Like every lead matters more so now than ever because there just aren't that many leads out there and people are being so much more conservative, I find, with their spending and what they're going to commit to and who they'll work with and where they're getting information. There's all of this. So this is a real value, valid concern. I don't want anybody to think that I'm here saying like, no, no, no, just ignore that because I think that's baloney. Like, let's be honest about what's going on in the market and what I would say to that and the way that I am doing everything I can to assist my clients is we're being more creative. One, understanding the process, making sure we're asking the right questions that we're identifying quickly whether or not this is a potential lead and whether or not you're going to spend time on it. And then the other thing too is there's kind of two things I'm going to say. One is I find a lot of times my clients are. They don't think about it, or they've been hesitant to go back to any of their existing clients to talk about any additional work. And so that's something I've been working with the clients a lot on and they're finding success there. How do you approach that in a, in a way that doesn't feel like, oh, I don't want to come across desperate. Well, you don't need to be desperate and you can still be of service to your existing clients. Like repeat business in sales is always easier to earn than new business. Right. So there's that piece. And then the other thing too is getting a little bit more creative about the offers that they have. So that's another place that sometimes you know, somebody, and I've worked with a designer on this too where you know, it's like it's all or nothing. You either hire me for the full service thing or that's it. And when you know, leads are scarce and we've got to keep the lights on and money needs to come into the business. One of the things that we worked on was what I call a downsell offer. Like what's a getting started offer with you? Because sometimes people just need that like first step and then they'll take the next and the next and the next. And so it might turn out to be a much bigger project than you even thought it would be at the get go. And we have to give people a way to get started because there's that know like and trust thing that's going on. Again like we're more conservative with our money right now. So sometimes we need a down sell offer. And so being creative about what could that be? What's a, what's a way that somebody could do something with you get that first step going so that then we can sell them the second step and the third and the fourth and then ultimately the full project and, or more.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: My wife had a, like almost that exact example earlier this week where she went and met with the prospective new client who was a referral. And the referral happened because she went back and contacted her past clients over the past couple of months. And so when she met with them she went under. The, the idea was all they wanted was a design consultation. That's all they wanted to do.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And so when she sat down with them, well of course they wanted to completely renovate the entire main floor of their home and possibly the bedrooms upstairs. But they, they didn't want to do it now. This is a next year or next year kind of project. Well, so she could have just walked out. She, I mean everything went well. They were more than happy just based on the referral that, that she was going to do the design work for them, this consultation. Well, she said, well okay, but we're going to do this work in a year's time or two years time down the road. We could kind of take you part way there. And so now they're going to do, they're going to do the drawings, they're going to do more of the actual design work as opposed to just a consultation. So instead of it being, you know, A small job. It's now a medium sized job.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And in a year or two, when it's now, they're like, okay, we feel comfortable that we can proceed with this. In theory, they could take all of those documents, all the drawings and everything, and go to another designer and have them do everything. But I gotta figure she's, you know, ahead of the game there, and they're gonna look to her to come and finish the rest of the work. So it's both things, Right. She kind of said, fine, I'll take a small job. But she kind of upsold it a little bit and to try to provide value to the client and explain to them, you know, why doing this will actually save them time and money. A year or two years.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. And real. And like, the reality of it is she's already built relationship and rapport with this, you know, with this couple. And so when they are ready to take that next step, as long as she keeps the relationship intact, why wouldn't they come to her to give the business? Right. Like, why would they feel like they need to go search and find somebody else? So you're right. Like, she, she has already set herself up to. She's not guaranteed the business by any means. She still has to earn it. But the fact of the matter is, like, we like to buy from people that we like, and we like to buy with from people that we know, and we like to buy from people we trust. Like, there's a saying about this. No, like, and trust, like there's a reason for it and it matters. You know, I have clients that will come and work with me and then, you know, go away and do. Do other things, focus on other areas of their business. And when they're struggling with the sales thing, they come back to me. And whether it's a small, you know, spotlight session with me or it's a full, like, okay, I need another, like, VIP program with you, Nikki. And they will buy again and again and again. But it's because I deliver, right? When we're working together and they know that there's no hard feelings for them to go away and come back when they're, when they're ready. Like, that's, that's totally fine. So you want to make sure that people have that opportunity. And again, if you show up and you're like, no, it's all or nothing, then oftentimes, especially where we are right now in our, you know, in, the economy, then it's nothing. Like, I just worked with a client the other day Who? She kind of did that with somebody. She was like, it's all or nothing. And then she hired me and we started working together. We came up with like, a kind of getting them back into her realm and working with her. And it was a, it's a retainer client. So it's something that. It's like you had nothing. You know, you had. Yes, they were a great client and they were paying you all this money every month. And then things happen and you're like, you either pay me all this money or you go find someone else to work with. Well, they chose to go work with someone else. Now she's going back to them and saying, hey, let's have a step down version. Like, let's. And they're like, oh, that would be great. And then at some point when they're, you know, things change and they're ready to step back up, like, that will happen and it'll happen with her. And sometimes it's better to have, you know, in this case, a couple thousand dollars or, you know, a month coming in versus nothing. Right. Like, at least it pays the bills, keeps the lights on.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, for sure. That kind of leads into what I was going to ask with everybody now. A little bit like Maybe not nervous is the right word, but questioning where we're going to go. You know, is there going to be a bigger impact with tariffs and all that kind of stuff? People may not be thinking 100% logically about these decisions. Right. Like, they realistically could afford to do this kitchen renovation, but, they're just feeling the nerves. Right. So are there things that designers can do in that sales process to help them maybe get over those nerves or. And. And things they should not do, like to screw themselves on a sale?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Well, one of the things you don't want to do is try to convince somebody that they're wrong about how they feel. Right. Because when you go into this mode of like, yeah, but here's why you're thinking about this wrong, you're essentially saying to somebody like, you're wrong. And that breaks rapport. And it's not going to help in that. In that conversation. Now, there is a technique. This might be a little bit of a deeper time than what you're expecting. So. Well, I'll give you kind of the high level view, of it. So there's a technique that I teach that's known as chunking sideways. It's very nlp, but I teach it from a sales perspective that sometimes we have to get People out of thinking about just the thing. So in this case, this idea of, like, I'm nervous about, you know, spending money because tariffs and this, this, this and that. Right. And so we got to get their mind thinking about something else. But it needs to relate back to the thing that we want for them to just see if there's some wiggle room a little bit about looking at something from a new perspective. So it's. It's asking permission to get the, opportunity to put some kind of a new perspective in front of them. But you. You actually will talk about it from a. Like, something that's totally unrelated in this case to design or tariffs. Right. So think about, I'm trying to come up with an example off the fly here. But so if somebody's pushing back around, like, I don't know if we should really be doing our kitchen right now because, you know, tariffs are going to cause the price of things to, you know, like, materials are expected to go up significantly. So I feel really nervous about that. And so you want to validate. Like, that's a valid concern. That absolutely makes sense. And there are some things that, you know, you might want to think about here. Can I offer you some. Can I offer you some suggestions? Right? Like ask permission, get the. Yes. And then you might say, you know, it's one of those things, like, I don't know if you've ever heard this. This, this saying, it's a Chinese proverb, that the best time to plant a cherry tree was 20 years ago, and the second best time is today. And so when you think about that, and you think about how, yes, material prices might go up, but you can look back in other industries where there's been some price changes because of something happening in the market, but the thing that rarely happens is prices go down. So when you think about, you know, like, college tuition, for instance, like, people go, I don't know if I should go to college because it's really expensive. But, in reality, if you wait five years, the tuition prices go up significantly. So the same is probably going to be true when it comes to redoing your kitchen. Like, yes, prices might go up, but they're not likely to go down. So if you do it today, you're not going to regret five years from now that you've lived in this beautiful kitchen that you absolutely love for the last five years. And when you start looking at material prices five years out, it's very unlikely they're going to be less. Right. So I just did this Little like, I tried to take them out of the concept of the kitchen. Price talked about college tuition, which maybe they relate to or maybe not, but give them this idea of, like, things are usually better today, and making decision today versus waiting and looking back. And, you know, you live in a. And work in a kitchen that you don't love for five years. Like, at some point you're going to be like, dang, the best time to plant that cherry tree was, you know, five years ago. And I waited and I regret it. So.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah. Especially with something like someone's home, right? Because, I mean, if you're looking at, you know, a family and they've got kids and the kitchen is the hub of the home and all that kind of stuff, it's like, so what is the value, whether financial or emotional or whatever, to that kitchen being this beautiful, functional, thing that you can be proud of? And it. It just makes those family interactions just that much better. Right? And I mean that, to me, what I just said does sound a little salesy, but.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Well, you have to help people, like, if that's important to them, right? Like, do they have a family? Do they enjoy family? Like, being in the kitchen together? And when they celebrate holidays and things like that, is the kitchen where they gather? And do they want to make that an environment that's inviting and, and lovely for people and they. They want to be there, or does it cause people to be like, there's no room in the kitchen, so I can. I need to, like, go to the other room. And then you miss out on those. Those experiences and those conversations and those, you know, those memories that you're creating. So again, it's not the idea here isn't to try to change somebody's mind. It's just the idea is to give them another way to look at it. And if they're open to looking at it in a new way, oftentimes it's not about you convincing them. They'll convince themselves that, like, oh, yeah, I really do want those experiences with my kids in the kitchen, and I want them to be able to sit at the counter while I'm, you know, at the stove and have conversations and, you know, have a place for us to, you know, cross cookies together for the holidays or whatever it is. But if that's important to them, then we want to bring that into the conversation. And not in a manipulative way, but just in a way to, like, get their mind thinking about it. Because you had mentioned this earlier, the idea of story, right? Like, we, they say story is the language of the brain. And we, we love stories because it gives us something to imagine. And our brains like process story. Stories have a beginning, a middle and an end. Like episodic memory, they really matter. So when you can start to paint some pictures in somebody's mind, they will start to create story. And you may have heard this saying, they say, you, know, a picture is worth a thousand words. Have you heard that saying before? Pictures worth a thousand words? There's one about story and it says a story is worth a thousand pictures. So we got to create some story.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And when we come back to what you've been saying about asking questions, if, if you, if you've been telling, rather than asking, how will you know all of those things that are important to this potential client to even do that, to take them out of that frame of mind where they're focused on price and financial insecurity and, and slide them sideways so that they can see that there are other valuable aspects to why they should be doing this project with you.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, and the other thing I would add about that too, what you just said is by asking questions, you're essentially challenging their brain to start to think about something, to start to provide answers. If you're telling them something, they're just taking that information in. But by asking the question, they're actually processing information. So I would say like, question. When you ask the brain a question, our brains are like Google. If you go to Google right now and you type in anything, doesn't matter what it is, Google tries to give you an answer, doesn't mean it always gets the right answer, but it tries to give you an answer. And so by asking a question, it challenges our brain to immediately want to come up with an answer. That's how our brains work. Right? There's, there's like, there's science around this. This is what, this is how our brains work. So by asking questions, you're, you're allowing them to really start to process information, but by talking at them, you're just telling, telling, telling, and they're just like, I'm just taking information in. It's not really challenging my brain to like process and think about it and paint a picture and all that stuff.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: For sure. And the whole process is it should be focused on them, not on us.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah. They are always more interesting to themselves than anything you could say. That's just the fact of the matter.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah. So in preparation for this, I, I did a little bit of a dive into your work. And, I was really curious about, buying signals. And, and I think this is something that designers really need to hear is your, your point of view on, on buying signals. So if you could and feel free of the talk as much as you want about this, I'm interested.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Well, I love buying signals. Buying signals are verbal and non verbal cues that people give that indicate interest. And your job is to recognize a buying signal and act on it in the moment. So my second book is all just like, literally, it's called Buying Signals. It's all about buying signals. If you get the third book that it's in there too. But buying signals, knowing what they are, how to recognize them and how to act on them in the moment can be the difference maker in your business. So I always say, if you don't know what a buying signal is, like, this is another place that we want to learn. So I'll just give you a couple examples of different buying signals and then the idea of like, what most people do with it and then what you actually need to do with it, right? So here's a really obvious buying signal. Somebody says, and maybe it's obvious, but most people, when I say it, they're like, duh, Nikki, everybody knows that's a buying signal. If somebody asks you about your pricing, right? Like, what does it cost to work with you? Now that's a potential buying signal. I actually hear a little, I actually hear a noise in my brain when I hear buying signals. I always think, ding, ding, ding. Pay attention, Nikki. Like, you gotta, you gotta do something here. So now most people might give an answer to the question. Now a lot of times people give a terrible answer to the question. They say something like, well, it depends. That's never the answer to the buying signal, question about price. Even if there's part of you that's saying right now. But Nikki, it does depend. I know. And that's not the answer to the question. So when somebody asks you about your price, you give an answer, but you immediately have to follow up with an invitation. So you might say, like, like, you know, what is it? Like, what do people pay to work with you? You might say something as a designer, you might say, typically, you're looking at, you know, 10 to 20% of your overall budget would go to your design fees. And then here's where I'm going to issue the invitation. Is that something you'd be interested in talking a little more about? Or I might say, are you, Is that within budget? Right? Like, I gotta act on it. I have to follow up with a question. I can't just give the answer. You 10 to 20% within, you know, of your overall budget if you just leave it there. Okay. That's just information. But if you ask them the question, the follow up question is that, is that, is that in alignment with what you were looking for? Thinking about now their brain has to do the work and give an answer. Now we get more information. If they're like clutching their pearls going, like, I had no idea that's how much it was. Well, now I know I'm probably not talking to an ideal client. And if they're like, oh, yeah, that's absolutely within budget, now we can dig deeper, we can ask another follow up question. So that's just one example of a buying signal. I'll give you. Can I give you one more? Okay.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Okay, so I'm going to give you one more. That often throws people off. They often are surprised when I say, this is a buying signal. Someone will bring up a negative experience about what it is that you do. So in this case design, they're like, oh, well, my friend work with a designer and she had this horrible experience and she just said she would never do it again. Right. Like, most people go like, I hate when that happens. And I say, oh, that's a potential buying signal. Let's act on that and see what can happen. So you might say, you know, you want to validate what they've said. Like, gosh, I'm so sorry, that was your experience with your. That your friend had. Here's what my clients experience when they work with me. And then I'm going to follow up then I'm going to say one or two things and then I'm going to say, now, is there ever a way that I could be a resource to you? And I'm going to wait and I'm going to see what they say next. I can't tell you how many times people have said to me, oh my gosh, Nikki, I tried working with a sales coach before and I just, I just couldn't follow their process. It just felt so icky to me. And I always say, like, I never jumped down in the pit and go, well, who was it? Because I heard bad things about them too, right? Like, I never jump in the pit. I always say, like, oh my gosh, I'm so sorry that that was your experience. One of the things that my clients get when they work with me is it's customized to them. So the process is customized so there isn't this idea of trying to do it like me or something that's out of alignment with them. It really is about finding their style and giving them strategy that's going to work for them. Then I'm going to follow up with an invitation. Is that something you'd be interested in learning more about? Because that's, you know, these buying signals, they're out there all the time, everywhere, and you just never know when you're going to get one. So you got to be on the lookout. You need to be aware of what those buying signals are and then how to follow up with that invitation. Because oftentimes people haven't even decided to work with you or hire you yet. But they'll give you a potential buying signal. Maybe not even at a conscious level realizing they're giving you a buying sign signal, but by you ask, answering, the question, or, you know, commenting and then following up with an invitation. Oftentimes they'll be like, oh, yeah, I had this happen one time. A woman came up to me at an event and she said, First words out of her mouth is, are you Nikki Roush? Which I said, I am, because I am, right? What was I supposed to say? And then she says, yeah, I'm like, no, get away from me. No. Yes, I'm Nikki Roush. And she said, oh, my friend, you know, Aaron was talking about you, blah, blah, blah. And I said, oh, that's. That's so great. I really appreciate that she shared about me. And I'm wondering, is there a way I can be a resource to you? And I'm not even joking. I don't know if your people will see this video, but I'm gonna. I'm gonna do it. But I'll. I'll describe what I'm doing. She went like this with her head. She went like. She looked up to the side, and then she tilted her head the other way and looked up to the other. The other, you know, looked above at the ceiling. And then she looked back at me and she's like, I don't know, maybe. And then we continued the conversation from there. She became a private coaching client. She was a coaching client for a long time, and she heard me tell this story one time, and she called me, because I never say who the client is, right? So she called me and she's like, that story's about me, isn't it? And I said, it is about you. I said, do you remember that morning when you came up to me at that event? You Asked me, and I said, now, when you came up to me, did you come up to me with the idea that we were going to work together? And she's like, no, not at all. And I said, well, what happened? Like, how did we get here? How did we get to work together? And I am not joking. This was her response. Nikki, you asked. Exactly. That's what I teach. That's what it's about. You ask the question. And I always say it's an invitation. Because most people understand that just because you get an invitation doesn't mean you have to join, doesn't mean you have to do it. Right. So invite people and see what happens. Oftentimes they'll be like, thank you for the invitation. I'm. I'm so in. Sometimes they'll say, thanks, no, thanks. And that's okay, too. But your job is to make those invitations. And they happen as a result of buying signals.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, I remember my dad telling me when I was, trying to ask out a girl, and I was terrified to do it. And, he said, you know, son, you don't ask, you don't get. Like, that's how life is, right? So you go. You go ask that girl out, and she totally turned me down. And, you know, that's just the way that worked out. But, yeah, you know, I asked another girl out, and she. She went out with me, right? So, like, you don't ask, you don't get.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Well, wouldn't the worst thing be for someone to say, like, well, I only went out with this person because you never asked me, and you're thinking like, dang, or, I never hired you as a designer because I didn't think you would want to work with me. Dang. Like, no, it's not that I don't want to work with you. I just felt nervous about asking or I wasn't sure how to ask. Right. And I hear this all the time. And because I teach about buying signals, people still come up to me at events, or they'll send me emails going, like, hey, Nikki, you know, I gave so and so, a buying signal. And they didn't. They didn't even ask me to work with them. And then they'll. They'll make some assumption. They'll be like, oh, they just don't think I'm the right client for them. Or, oh, they don't think they. I, you know, can afford their services. And nine out of 10 times, that's not true. It's that. But the person just missed the buying signal. Or they got nervous about issuing that invitation. But the other person doesn't go like, oh, bless their heart. They struggle with sales. They go, no, that person doesn't like me. They make it about themselves. Right. I never want anybody to think, oh, Nikki doesn't want to work with me. I want them to go like, hey, Nikki invited me to work with her, and I got to say yes or no, and that's it. I don't take it more personal than that.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: No, for sure. Kind of tying back into, our. Our concerns right now with the economy. I'm assuming a lot of the pushback, is going to be on price. I mean, it's always going to be on price, but it's definitely going to be on price right now.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And, you know, talking about the story you told, where if people, you know, the potential client is saying, the designer, you know, you know, my friend had this really bad experience, they wouldn't be having the meeting with your designer client in the first place if they weren't interested at some level.

Right. So you nailed it. They've. They've expressed an interest in doing now, whether it works with you or with someone else, but they're express. They're. They're expressing their fear, their concern. Right. So how do you handle that? Do you try to make them feel like they're in a safe space or, or whatever.

Or do you tell them, you know, that's ridiculous, or, oh, that must have been a horrible design. Right. I mean, it requires a certain amount of bravery on their part to say that to you, that, you know, this. This bad experience. And they're implicitly saying, we don't want this to happen to us.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. So what they're essentially looking for is some kind of reassurance from you about how working with you will be different, and your job is to offer that up to them. I'm so sorry you had that experience. Here's what you can expect when we work together. Is that something you're.

That. Is that something that's in alignment for you? Is that something that would fit for you? Like, all you're doing is offering information, and they can, you know, take it or not take it. But chances are, if you're willing to, like, I'm sorry, that was your experience, or, gosh, that.

That does sound like a terrible experience. Here's what you can expect when we work together, and just making it in the, like, present terms of what, what's going to happen and what the process is, how you're going to reassure, or, or make sure that whatever their fear is is not going to come to fruition.

Now you have to understand what the fear is. Hopefully they'll, you know, through your questions you've, you've determined like, what's that thing that they're hesitant about? What's the thing that's holding them back? And then there is this idea of, you know, we talk about objections in sales, right?

Like people have objections. And your job when somebody voices an objection is to check to see can you overcome it. And the way you do that is through what's known as a conditional close question. So, the structure of a conditional close question is if I were able to solve this, overcome this, would you then be willing to X, Y and Z, move forward, hire me, do whatever?

Now you're gonna change your conditional close question based on the context. But if somebody's pushing back around, like, you know, I have some real fear about working with a designer because my friend had this really bad experience and they got, you know, four months and, or four, weeks into the process and the designer like completely dropped the ball and just disappeared.

Then you can say, I'm really sorry that happened to you. One of the things that, that you can expect when you work with me is we have this process that involves follow ups. If for any reason that process fell by the wayside, if I put into your contract that you would have an out, would that make you feel more comfortable about working, working together?

Right. Like, I'm just checking to see if I can overcome the objection. And if she's like, there's really nothing you could say because I just don't trust you, well, that's not your client, so bless and release, that's okay. But we've got to check. We have to be willing to extend ourselves in some way.

And you had mentioned earlier a lot of the, you know, a lot of designers out there are solopreneurs or they have a small team. One of the benefits of having a small team or being a solopreneur is you're nimble and you can make adjustments to your contract. You can, you can offer something that is going to solve or potentially overcome that objection for somebody without it, like bringing your business down.

Right. So that's what's so great about being, you know, us, entrepreneurs is we have some ability to be flexible.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: You just made me think about something there with when you're talking about small, scale designers being having the ability to be nimble. I've been listening to podcasts now Business podcasts for designers for a solid two years. And I've heard a lot of coaches come on, and there's a couple of things that really stick in my craw when I keep hearing it over and over again, is that designers need to be focused on always upscaling to the most luxury clients possible, like the ultra elite mansions.

And I'm like, one, not everybody wants to do that and it requires certain things in your business to be able to deliver that level of service. Right.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yes, yes, that's such a great point. You know, one of the best things that the best offers I've ever put out into the market, my clients have designed them for me. They'll be like, you know what you should be selling, Nikki, or, you know, what I would really find valuable from you. Okay. Like, I listen to those things and I always say, like, if, if I get told something three to five times, you better believe it's becoming an offer or it's becoming a podcast episode, or it's because, like, when, if I get the same question, three to five like it, it's such great feedback.

And the way that you get that is by putting yourself in, in conversations with prospective clients, like, you're just building muscles. So even if you feel uncomfortable about the conversations, the more reps you get under your belt, the easier it gets.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And two, they'll say, well, you need to have this, your, your signature style and the way your operations are, is, is set in

And if the client doesn't agree, well, then tough for them. And I'm like, I don't think that works in real life. It sounds great on the podcast. Like we're all on team designer and we're going to make sure you don't get screwed over by your client. But that nimbleness that, that being under to understand your client and what their needs are and what they want out of this project and all that kind of stuff and the way you're describing sales is something completely different to that message that I'm hearing.

I mean, maybe I just, I'm pumping your tires here a little bit because, I mean, I'm just, I really like the approach you're bringing.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Thank you. I will say t

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, I remember my dad telling me when I was, trying to ask out a girl, and I was terrified

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Well, w

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Oh, no, for sure. I agree 100%. I mean, if. If you're a coach and, and you're a coach of interior designers, what is the purpose? To make the designer feel good about themselves or to make their clients, you know, their prospective clients turn into actual clients and help them build a business that, they can be proud of and fill their bank accounts up and have a, you know, the life they want.

Like, that's the goal, right?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. I mean, I'm not ashamed to admit in any stretch of imagination that, my goal is for my clients to make more money so that they make. They get to work with more of their ideal clients so they make more of an impact in the world, not just in their business, but in their families and in their communities, and that comes from making money.

So I'm not going to give you advice that sounds good to you. I'm going to give you advice that will move the needle, and I'm going to give you structure and strategy and language to do that, because otherwise, like, you know, I one time asked somebody who had achieved a really high level of success, and I asked her a very specific question about a process that she was doing with her podcast.

So as podcasters, I think, you know, it's like somebody's achieved a really high level of success at their podcast. Like, I asked her a very specific question, and her answer back to me was, nikki, just pretend you're famous and people will believe you. And I was like, that is the worst piece of advice and a, nothing burger that anybody has given me before.

And I'm sure her intention was good. She was a nice person. And, you know, she is successful. But, like, okay, that just says to me, she can't articulate to me what her process is. Totally fine. That she doesn't know what her process is. But if. Or she's not willing to share it, and either.

Either way is fine. But telling somebody to just pretend that they're this and that's going to make all the difference in their business is, like, it's a nothing burger. Don't pay money for it.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: All right, I want to switch, to, I. Before, I, when I knew I was going to have you on the podcast, I contacted a whole bunch of designers and say, okay, I'm having Nikki Roush on. Do, you have any questions for. I figured why not? Right? And the, and, and my number one question is how important is follow up to the sales process, which we just discussed. So I guess, I guess we can, we can say we've covered that.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Well, can I add something to it? Because here's where the follow up falls down. And this is, this is the piece that I teach, right. Is that if you're going to have a great consultation discovery call, sales call with a prospective buyer and you agree to put together a proposal for them or scope of work, and you're going to send it over for them to review.

Here's the most important thing that you do is you schedule a time to review it with them. And this is where the follow up happens. Right. So we're gonna, so I'll have that to you on Thursday. Let's schedule a time to talk Friday morning. Do you have your calendar available? Does 10am work for you?

Great. Let's get it on our calendars. You'll have it Thursday night so you can look it over, and Friday we'll walk through it together and I'll answer any questions you have about it and then we'll talk about next steps for working together. That's the first most important thing. Now if they say, just send me the scope of work and I'll look it over and I'll let you know.

Okay, so now you have to decide how much follow up you're going to do. So follow up is crucial, but how you do it and how you schedule it. Because again, balance of power in the conversation. If you just act like I'm going to chase you, I'm just going to chase you and chase you and chase you.

I always say if you act like you're going to chase people, they turn into toddlers. I don't know if you've ever been around a toddler before, but you get around a toddler and you go, I'm going to chase you. The toddler doesn't even know why we're playing the game, but they're in and they start running, right?

And then what happens when you get tired or you decide you're not going to chase anymore? The toddler will start to, like, inch their way back to see like, what's going on or they'll go find a new thing to play with. Right. So you should not be chasing clients. You should have a process that's respectful of both of your times of as far as like the follow up goes.

So that means you offering to schedule and encouraging this next time we're going to chat. And even if they're like, thank you for the proposal, I looked it over, I need to talk to my spouse about it. Great. When we have that conversation, let's schedule another time so I can answer any questions for you. And as long as they stay in it with me, I will stay in it with them.

And I don't care if it takes a year or two years to earn somebody's business, I'll stay in it. But if they're like, like, just follow up with me when you feel like it. Now they're saying like, just chase me. I'm gonna act like a toddler. And I'm like, no, I'm not gonna chase.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, with, residential design, we quite frequently have to deal with multiple decision makers. How do we deal with that? I mean, if we're, we're trying to, to, you know, peel these details out of the, I mean, I don't want to, you know, generalize, but I mean, if it's a family home, it's more than likely going to be the the woman who is making most of the decisions.

I mean, but we've had that numerous times. When the husband gets involved, it, it tends to complicate matters a little bit. So any advice on, on dealing with two decision makers?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. So first and foremost in your questions, you always want to ask, and this is the way you frame it, you don't say like, are you the decision maker? That's a terrible question. A better question is, whom besides yourself will be involved in the decision making process? Then you wait, you see what they say.

So if they say my husband or, you know, my wife is going to be involved, or you know, my parents are giving me money and we're going to, you know, they want to be involved with whatever, whatever the answer is. Now your next question is what is the best way to get, to get us all on the same page? Like, could we set up a time where we could all chat together?

Is that a possibility? So I'm asking as a question what I'm not doing. As the designer is saying, well then we need to have a meeting where we're all on the Call together because that essentially says to that person, like, you're not important. I want them to know that they're important and I also want everybody else involved.

Now if the spouse gets involved and they have some concerns that didn't come up in the initial consultation, your job is to address those. Your job is to ask the right questions, to find out what are the hesitations and see if you can overcome them. And again, this is conditional, close question.

You might bring that into the conversation so that we can understand, like, how can we move forward? Is there a possibility? And if it's just down to like, there's nothing you could do, I'm not going to spend the money on this. My wife wants this. I don't. Then here's the hard truth about ideal clients.

Somebody can only be an ideal client for you if they're willing to spend the money to hire you. Otherwise they're not an ideal client. So I don't care how great the spouse is, but if the other spouse is like, doesn't matter what your price is, I'm not going to pay you.

They are not a client. Bless and release, move on.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And frequently, or all too frequently, you'll have the spouses arguing, you know, as soon as the meetings are done or the phone calls you've got off, the, the phone calls, they're, they're going back and forth debating the points and then the designer thinks that they've left things on a positive note.

Meanwhile, you know, they're arguing back and forth. So if you don't get those details out of, you know, whoever has a stake in this. Right. You're setting yourself up for trouble.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, I mean, don't be afraid to ask somebody like, what, what are your hesitations? What are your concerns about moving forward with this project? And wait and see what they say. That's a perfect opportunity for them to say, well, I was never expecting to spend, you know, $150,000 on a, you know, on a designer for a remodel.

Okay, so again, does that then say, well, what? My follow up question then would be like, well, what were you planning to invest? Because I want to know. And if they say nothing over a hundred thousand, then do I have a downsell offer to get them started? Because sometimes you get in there, they get the first, you know, project under the belt with you and they're like, they become your biggest advocate, your hugest fan, they'll be shouting from the rooftops how awesome you are and they'll have no problem moving forward with the Next stage.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, for sure. And I mean, it's, it's a learning process as well from, for the designer. Right. As you're asking these questions and maybe realizing that whether it's your sale, your process, like any, any part of your process, of your business, maybe there are holes. And by asking these questions, the. Your potential clients are pointing out you've got a hole here in your system. Right. And then you can go back and fix it. And, you know, even if it doesn't work for that client, it maybe works for the next one down the road, right?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yes, yes, that's such a great point. You know, one of the best things that the best offers I've ever put out into the market, my clients have designed them for me. They'll be like, you know what you should be selling, Nikki, or, you know, what I would really find valuable from you. Okay. Like, I listen to those things and I always say, like, if, if I get told something three to five times, you better believe it's becoming an offer or it's becoming a podcast episode, or it's because, like, when, if I get the same question, three to five like it, it's such great feedback.

And the way that you get that is by putting yourself in, in conversations with prospective clients, like, you're just building muscles. So even if you feel uncomfortable about the conversations, the more reps you get under your belt, the easier it gets.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: 100%. Next question was about referrals and, interior design being like a super referral heavy business. But, these designers almost to a person were saying, you know, we don't have a plan for soliciting referrals or, or repeat work.

And I'm like, how can you not. Is that something that you help your clients out with, like coming up with a process to do that?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, like finding the process that works the best for you. But here's the, here's the basics of every process is you have to ask. And it's not because people don't want to refer you. It's just because they, they're not thinking about you. They're thinking about themselves. They're thinking about what are they going to have for dinner or what bill do they have to pay or what's, you know, what's the kids schedule and where do they have to be at what time.

So unless you plan the seed by asking the question, the chance of you getting a referral are slim to none. Now, having a consistent process of staying front of mind is also important, and there's lots of Ways you can do that. For some of my clients, we do that through their newsletter. For others, we actually have like a program that they send out, you know, a card with a little like refer a friend.

Like, you know, here's a whatever, a half price consultation call or whatever just to get the process started. And for every designer it might be a little bit different, but yeah, referrals, like again, you know, repeat business is the easiest business to earn.

And the second easiest is referral business if you do it well because you get to ride the coattails of the credibility of the person who's referring you. Right. Like somebody who reaches out to me blind is probably not going to get a response. But somebody who reaches out and is referred by a trusted colleague of mine or a trusted friend, friend of mine, I'm going to pay attention to that.

And the same will be true with your referrals. When their friend is referring them or somebody they trust is saying like, this is the designer, you know, we, we recommend her highly or him highly for this and that. Like that, that carries weight. It matters.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah. The idea that a designer should wait for that past client to have some discussion with a neighbor or a friend or something and they're saying, you know, I've been thinking about renovating my kitchen. They're like, I got the designer for you. I'm like, that does happen like 100%.

But it's like, why would you not want to, you know, keep your face, you know, in their world a little bit? Right?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. Even if it's, you know, I just. We had, I had a designer client actually where we did this thing where she a couple times a year sends out these really cool little postcards and that has resulted in business just these little postcards to her past clients that, you know, they, each one has talked about something different, but it's been like helpful and useful and it's colorful and it's, you know, got a beautiful image of something like some piece of work that she's done, just even that of like staying front of mind with people and you go like direct, mail.

Like nobody likes direct mail. Well, not a lot of people are doing direct mail in this kind of business anymore. And so it does make you stand out for in, in her, in her realm, in her marketplace. It definitely makes her stand out. And she's working with very high end clients, so they're still seeing it.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And with residential designers, I mean, realistically, how many clients in a year of like full design projects. Does a designer actually have. If you did handwritten letters, for crying out loud, you could bang that out over a weekend. Right. And nobody gets mail anymore?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Like, no, nobody gets organized.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: No. All I get in my mailbox are, are not even bills anymore. All I get is flyers. That's all I get in my mailbox. If I was to receive a letter from somebody that would stand up.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yes, I got one yesterday that looked like a letter. And then I looked at it and I was like, oh, this actually isn't a letter. This is. This is a, you know, it is an ad. But, but it caught my attention and I had a huge stack of mail, and that's the one thing I went and grabbed because it looked like it was a handwritten note, but it turned out it actually wasn't, but it, it caught my attention enough to slow me down to look at it.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, yeah, for sure. Consultations. This is another thing that, from listening to all these interior design business podcasts, it used to be that, that the first in person consultation with the client is free.

Everybody did that. And then I don't know how many years ago, two or three years ago, I started hearing podcasters saying, well, you have to charge, everybody has to charge for their consultation. And now everybody charges for their consultation.

Like, I've talked to designers who charge 500 for just this first meeting, just to sit down with them. I honestly don't know how I feel about doing that. So I was. This is a question I thought would be great to have you answer.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, yeah. So I definitely have worked with designers where we have figured out how to position the fee. Right. When there's a fee for it. I will say, I do believe that if you're going to charge a fee for something, there needs to be a deliverable. So they need to have walked away feeling like they got something out of the call, whether they hire you or not.

Also, it's a great opportunity to, if you are charging a fee for it, that you offer them the opportunity to apply that fee towards their project with you, and you work that into the, you know, or percentage of it, depending. I have some designers that will apply 50%, I have some that apply 100%.

And, you know, you get to decide. I will say again, what I really love is if that is your process and you have somebody who's pushing back on it and you are willing to make some kind of concession on it in order to earn their business, that may be the thing that you need to do to Earn their business is to make that concession on that first fee.

You have to decide that, you know, and how to frame it and all of that. I can. I work with clients on how to do that, so I'm not opposed to doing it. And here's what I would say is if you feel like you're losing business because you're not giving it away for free, then it probably is time for you to revisit.

You know, if the fee is causing people to be like, oh, no. You know, one of the things I always ask my designers when we talk about this is what is your. What's your conversion rate when you go on site and do, in person call. And if they have a pretty high conversion rate.

Conversion rate, then I tell them you need to be flexible on that fee. Because if you have a 75% chance of earning that business, and that's a $50,000 project, and you're haggling with them over them paying a 500 fee, like, you're.

What is that saying? Like, you're stepping over dollars to pick up dimes or whatever. Like, that is insane to me. You know, you have to. To do what's. What's best for you. But I find a lot of times, just if somebody pushes back and you say, well, the fee for that is $500, and they're like, what, $500?

You don't do that for free. Like, I don't think we're. I don't think we want you to come on site. Then I think we'll move on to another designer. Then you have the opportunity to say, what if I was willing to. What if I was willing to split the difference and cut that fee in half? Would that make it more feasible for you? Like, oftentimes I find if I'm willing to split the difference between something for people.

Now here's the thing. It's still a $50,000 project, and now they're only getting $250 applied toward. Towards it. Not the 500. Right. Like, be careful that you're not trying to stand in your place of, like, I'm an expert and I want to be valued for my, you know, let's.

Let's get the business.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: No, and I think that came from a place where people were having designers come out and, and, and, you know, you're investing, you know, including driving time, probably three hours for a meeting.

And. And to say that that time doesn't have value is, Is ridiculous. And it, would set up that. That kind of power dynamic where you're the, the surf in the relationship and you know, they're calling all the shots. So I get why they did that, but it's that, it's that rigidity that drives me crazy.

And I mean, use the word nimbleness and I'm like, let's go over there, be a bit more nimble and don't get. So especially when it's a small business and you've got these rigid, rigid rules. I don't understand the. And if all you did was lose one project because of that, because of being rigid to, you know, to get that five hundred, you're giving up a fifty thousand dollar project.

Well, how many consultations does that? Right, yeah, that's what, that's 100 consultations, right?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, yeah. That's insane, right? I would say the, you know what I found to be true is the person who has the most flexibility in a conversation has the most influence. So this idea of being nimble in a conversation and being willing to be flexible, it allows for you to have more influence.

Now I'm not saying like, well, they said they didn't like my fee, so I just, you know, I cut it in half. Like that's not what I'm saying. Like there needs to be. I actually don't believe in discounting your fee unless you get something in return. So offering discounts and things like that, and I'm not opposed to those, however, I won't do it for nothing.

I have to get something in return because again, it creates a balance of power. Right? So if you're just giving, giving, giving and making concession after concession after concession, then you're not, you know, like they're not going to value you. But if I say I'm willing to waive that fee, if you're willing to agree that, you know, you'll sign the contract on site for us to work together, you know, you're going to make a decision on site.

Okay, well now I'm willing to waive my fee to get a $50,000 gig. Like, okay, I'll do that. So, you know, like that's the idea of like you want to have influence in the conversation and sometimes it's just learning to like, what could I say here that would offer some wiggle room for me and for them so they feel like they got a win and I'm getting ultimately what I want here, which is to earn their business.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: And in a way that, that, that consultation fee now becomes transformed from this, almost like purity test of like, you know, you're going to respect who I am as a designer to becoming a negotiating tool. Right. Like, if you went into it thinking, I don't really care about this $500, I'm, I'm happy to play with that and we can use that if that gets me to sign the contract right away. Why would I not do that?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, yeah. So again, it's just learning how to add a little flexibility and you know, being nimble in your business when you're a small business owner, like, there's some real advantages. And that's one of our advantages of being a small business owner is that we have the ability to be flexible. You know, when you're working for somebody.

You know, when I was working at the largest manufacturer that I worked for and closing multimillion dollar deals for them, there were times where I would have to walk away from business because it didn't fit the company's policies. But yet, if I could go to my boss and if I could get him to allow me to make some kind of concession, I could earn the business.

And then, you know, I was their top producing rep in North America and, and they were like, wow, you know, like, how, how have you done this and how have you done that? Well, because I'm not trying to just follow, like, just because you have a rule doesn't mean it fits for everyone.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, yeah. And you got to look at the, at the cost benefit. Right? You're gonna stick to the purity of that rule and, and forego a fantastic piece of business.

The next question was about, how to quickly identify potential clients, to more from the point of view of finding clients that aren't going to work for you and like moving on from them quickly.

Is there a way within your five step process and like how we can kind of get to that?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah. So it is going to be in the questions that you ask. So I know sometimes for designers they'll put in place, like when somebody goes to, to like schedule a complimentary call with you, you might have a questionnaire that they answer. And one of the questions I always like, I will push back with my designers on that questionnaire and making sure that it's short and to the point and gets the basic information they need to decide whether or not they want to get on a call with somebody.

So one of the things that you could do, and this is a common thing that designers will ask in their, you know, in their questionnaire before someone gets on a call with them is like, what's your budget. And people will be like, I don't know. But then they get on a call with somebody and it's like, well, now I'm getting on the call with all these tire kickers.

They were never going to hire me because, you know, so one of the things we'll do is we'll frame the question. Like typically a project, you know, a three, you know, a three bedroom or a three room design runs between X and Y. Where do you fall in that range? So now if they don't fall within that range and you know that like anybody who, you know is showing up saying, well, I was just looking to spend $5,000 on my designer and you know, like, that's not even in the ballpark, right.

Then you can bless and release very quickly and you can send a really nice message and say, you know, based on where you are and based with your budget, it doesn't look like this is a good fit. So as to not waste your time, let's go ahead and cancel this call. Right then I've just blessed and released. I didn't have to get on a call to tell them, like, I'm not interested in your $5,000 project.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, for sure. And, and definitely before we, we talk about having an in person meeting, like, we don't want to let it get to that, to that stage.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: No. So there are certain questions that you want to know, like, what is your, you know, think about what qualifies somebody right off the bat as a potential buyer for you? Those are the questions that you might ask. And when I say those are the questions, I'm going to say you're not allowed to ask more than five.

But I'd like it to be less than I'd like it to be three or less for. To schedule a consultation call. Because if you're asking somebody, I had a designer one time who hired me and she was like, nobody's filling this out. And you know, I'm really struggling to get clients. And when I looked at our form, I was like, it would take somebody an hour to fill out your intake form and you're asking them questions that you don't need the answers to until they actually hire you.

That is a waste of their time and frankly, a waste of yours. So we got to get all these questions off it. And as soon as we did, it was like this three question thing. And then people started actually answering the questions, getting on calls with her, and she had the opportunity to earn their business. But this like, tell me everything about Your project.

Tell me everything about your dreams. Where do you want to be in 10 years? Like, all that stuff that is garbage that does not belong in a discovery question questionnaire, for sure.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: No, that's something you do over some glasses of wine is what that is. Yeah, yeah. Last question from the designers is about social media. Instagram in particular. How do you think Instagram fits into a designer's sales process?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Well, I think think about where your buyers are. Are they on Instagram? Is that where they're getting information? So one of the ways that you can find is, ask the people who've actually invested money in you. Like, where, how did they find out about, you, like, where do they look for this kind of information?

Because it could be that they are looking on Instagram. And then, yes, you need to be there if that's where your buyers are. But you know, like, for me, I know that I asked my clients when they come in, like, how did we, how did we get connected? How do we get to work together? And I will say 8 out of 10 times, their answer is, I heard you on a podcast.

Well, guess where I spend all of my marketing dollars on podcast guesting. Because that's where people find me. So I always say, like, pour gasoline on, you know, the fire. And if there's a fire there, like, if it's on Instagram, by all means, yes, you should have a presence.

But if that's not what you're like, where your buyers are making decisions, like, I wouldn't be investing a bunch of time and money on something that doesn't move the needle.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Okay, well, you know what? I think you've sold me. I'm, I'm an interior designer, wants to work with you. What does that process look like? I get on a phone call with you. How does this go?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: So the process is I work with clients in two main ways. I do private coaching with clients. So there's an opportunity for us to work together. Whether it be, you know, one off strategy session where we're just working on like one or two things in your business, or if it's a longer term commitment where you're really wanting to refine your process.

That might be a three month kind of commitment that we work together in some private sessions. And you get access to me. I use a, I use an app where my clients can ask questions and get immediate responses from me. And it's me actually responding, so not somebody else.

And so there's that. And then I have the Sales maven Society, which is my group coaching program. And that's where you get to access, access to my training center, which has a myriad of training on different sales concepts and strategies. And then you get access to two live coaching calls with me a month in a group setting where you can come and ask questions.

So those are kind of the two main ways that I work with clients now, privately or in the group coaching. And both, both are good avenues, depending on what's most important to you. But most of my private coaching clients, I give them access to the, to my group coaching as well.

So they get, like, they get everything. When you come in and work with me privately, you get access to kind of. I don't play my, my cards close to my vest. Like, you get everything. If, if it's going to make a difference and move the needle in your business, you're going to get access to it.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Okay, if I was a good little client and did everything you said, can you give me a ballpark of what, what I could expect, like, best case scenario, happen to my business?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, I love this question. One of my goals, when, when somebody invests money to work with me, my objective is that they, they earn back their investment within the amount of time that we are working together. And then from there it just continues to grow and again and again and again.

So if you think about, if you are, you know, closing $10,000 sales, right, and you invest $2,000 or $3,000 or $5,000 in us working together, then I expect that by the end of our commitment that you have earned that money back.

But for you, it's like you got to close one more client, right? And you got your $10,000, so you got your $2,000 back. We've got $8,000 in, like, Nikki helped me close this deal. So this is $8,000 in profit, or depending on what your expenses are, maybe it's 50%. So, you know, it's $2,000 in profit.

And, and now I can use these skills again and again and again. So I would say, you know, realistically, I have clients that 10x their investment within a year of working with me. And I have some clients that, you know, earn back what they, what they invest in a year.

It really kind of comes down to implementers. Implementers get success. So implementation. I think I read this about your podcast too, right? Like, you're, like, you got to take action and implement. And that's what I say to my clients too. If you're willing to implement the things That I teach. They work. I don't.

I don't teach you things that I'm not willing to do or that I haven't done in the marketplace. So they work, and it's just about implementation. And you'll see that you will get a return on your investment from it.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: That sounds fantastic. Any questions I should have asked you and didn't ask you something maybe you thought of?

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Here's one thing that I think a lot of times people aren't sure to, like, how do you ask this question? Like, what if there's somebody out there that you know would be an ideal client for you, but you're not sure how to approach them? My suggestion in that case is to reach out to this person and ask, is there ever an opportunity where we might work together?

Like, Just ask the question, because all you're doing is planting the seed. Because they may not have even thought about, like. And they might be surprised by the question. That's okay. Let them process it. And maybe, maybe the answer is, I don't know. But two months from now, they become a client, or two years from now, they become a client, and it's because you issued that invitation in a really kind way.

It wasn't like, hey, you know, I looked at your home and you really need a remodel, so you should hire me. Like, that's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about doing it from a really kind way of, like, you know, you would be like, I would just absolutely might be so honored to work with you and work on your home.

Is that something you'd ever consider? Just ask that question and see what happens?

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah. And not for nothing, I mean, I don't know the percentage, with my wife's business, but, you know, when she goes to parties, whether it's holidays, birthdays, whatever it is, I mean, interior designers are not the kind of person that people don't want to talk to, to whether it's the homeowner or whether it's other guests.

They're like, oh, you're a designer. Wow. And they start talking about their home. And, But we come back to, if you don't, if you don't ask, if you don't, if you're not willing to kind of engage that part of your. Of your personality. Right. How are you going to get the business?

Otherwise? You've just left the party and it's like, oh, this person, you know, is talking to me about, you know, renovating their bathroom and. And, well, so what did we do about it? Well, we did nothing, but we just talked.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, that's where, yeah, that's where those buying signals come into play. That's where being able to create curiosity in those types of settings come into play. If you can create curiosity, oftentimes buying signals are the result of creating curiosity. And then you acting on those buying signals are where you turn that, that signal into something that translates into business money.

So that's really, really important. Yeah, I have a client where she's been, you know, going to all these summer parties, right? Block parties and stuff like that. And so before she goes, she's like, okay, here's my curiosity creating statement.

Nikki, do you have some feedback? What could I say here, what could I say there? And then she's coming back going like, that worked. Like, I usually sit back at the parties and don't say anything and nobody even knows what I do or, or who I am or how I work with clients. And now all of a sudden, just because she's prepared and she's showing up and she's saying things and people are like, tell me more about that or like, what would that look like to work with you?

And that is the difference that that can happen when you understand a little bit about your process and about sales for sure.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Well, this has been fantastic. I, I knew I was going to learn a lot from you and I did. And I'm so glad we're recording all of this because I plan to make use of it for sure.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Thank you. I hope you will.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yeah, definitely. And, and like we mentioned before we started recording, I would definitely like to do a, return podcast maybe with you and one of your clients at the same time and get their point of view as well. Hopefully I can get you back for that.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Yeah, absolutely. Can I offer, before we go, can I offer your audience a gift? Is that okay?

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: Yes. Okay.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: So because we talked about questions so much in the, in the show, I have a, I actually have a training and I normally charge for it. And it's it really is about identifying what are your criteria questions and what are your expertise questions. So it's called seal the deal questions that close sales and I'd love to just gift it to your audience.

So I'm not going to charge you for it. You go to the website, I'm going to give you a special link and the fee there is waived for you. So if you go to your salesmaven.com.forward/designher. So all one word design her for your. For your podcast listeners.

I'd love to gift that just to get people more comfortable with those questions, because it will absolutely make a difference to your business.

Douglas Robb - Interior DesignHer: That would be fantastic. And, of course, I'll make sure the link is in the show notes and all that good stuff. All right, well, thanks again, Nikki. I really love this talk.

Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven: Thank you so much. I appreciate your questions and your time. Thank you.

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Convert More Interior Design Prospects: Why Your Sales Conversations Aren't Working and What to Do Instead

Sales Maven founder Nikki Rausch (20+ years training sales teams) reveals the flexible conversation framework that converts prospects while competitors follow rigid scripts that cost them clients.

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Connect With Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven

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Convert More Interior Design Prospects: Why Your Sales Conversations Aren't Working and What to Do Instead

Sales Maven founder Nikki Rausch (20+ years training sales teams) reveals the flexible conversation framework that converts prospects while competitors follow rigid scripts that cost them clients.

Apple - Youtube Music - Spotify - Youtube

CHAPTERS:

Key Takeaways:

Read the Transcript:

Connect With Nikki Rausch - Sales Maven

Join the Interior DesignHer Community

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